When active learning stops

[clear]

I guess I should mention that I think "active learning" means. It means to learn new techniques; and once mastered/passed, moving on to more challenging new things. It requires concentrated practice and focusing on the most difficult parts and pushing beyond/expanding your abilities methodically.

I've been playing for about 3 years. Actively learned for the first 6 months via self-teaching using eMedia Ukulele Method and Ralph Shaw's Complete Ukulele Course; never finished either course. After those first 6 months, I've never practiced on the uke. If I get something wrong, maybe I'll get it right on the next try... possibly next week/next month/never.

Those initial 6 months taught me enough to strum all the songs I ever wanted to play (I only play from 1 ukulele song book with 40 songs; but I sometimes go to my local uke meets and play other songs). Although I've not been actively learning since, I play almost everyday so I've got the strumming and chords basics down very, very well (ok, as long as I'm on the first 5 frets; yes, I think the 2223 (D) is the highest I venture).

Sometimes I have a desire to learn some finger picking on the uke, but it's never a strong-enough to motivate me to actually do something about it. So, I'm stuck in strum-land with the uke, and it looks like this is where I'll remain. This is not to say I can't finger pick; I can pick easy songs ok-ish, and I pick once in a while.

I think everybody has somewhere he/she wants to be with the uke. Once the skills needed to do what the uke is needed for have been acquired, then the impetus to learn and advance the skills kind of disappears.

Just curious. Did you stop atcively learning to play? What method(s) are you following? Progress? Future plans?

 

[ripock]

I suppose it is all about your goals and assumptions. I basically want to be a soloist and a composer of my own music and an improviser. So I never stop actively learning. Everyday I run across something that I'll need to master and something to work on for a while...which leads to another thing to master.

Today I was playing around with the super lokrian scale which is, by another name, the altered scale--one of the foundational jazz scales. Playing and composing and improvising with a scale is a goal in and of itself. But then I started thinking: this is a heptatonic scale and there are 6 modes aside from what I'm playing. If I figured them out, then I'd be able to play all the way up to the 19th fret with this scale.

So that's how my mind works. I am always actively learning and expanding. I know it sounds a bit elite, and I wanted to say I would have some struggles with keeping in the pocket and strumming a song. I practice being unique and I'm good at what I practice. However I don't practice strumming and supporting a song. It would give me some difficulties having to play the same thing over and over again without inserting some variations. I wouldn't be very good at it.

 

[Oldscruggsfan]

It’s just attitude and perspective. I have a similar perspective as Ripock, but am unable to state it as eloquently. Though I’m lousy at uke strum patterns, if strumming were all I ever intended to learn, I’d put my DIY uke in the fire pit this evening and would never miss it. Meanwhile, learning good, clear, strum patterns is among my goals.

I played 5-string banjo for nearly 4 decades and never came even close to feeling I’d mastered it, or that there was nothing left to learn.

You touched on a subject that I know from direct experience. Not getting past the 5th fret on a uke is, no offense intended, self-limiting. Speaking not as a uke newbie but from 4 decades of banjo, it’s a good practice (and good for the brain) to learn at least 3 different versions of each tune up and down the neck (and varying between them) and in at least two different keys. Have you tried single string harmonics?
Cheers!

 

[jango]

I guess I should mention that I think "active learning" means. It means to learn new techniques; and once mastered/passed, moving on to more challenging new things. It requires concentrated practice and focusing on the most difficult parts and pushing beyond/expanding your abilities methodically.

I've been playing for about 3 years. Actively learned for the first 6 months via self-teaching using eMedia Ukulele Method and Ralph Shaw's Complete Ukulele Course; never finished either course. After those first 6 months, I've never practiced on the uke. If I get something wrong, maybe I'll get it right on the next try... possibly next week/next month/never.

Those initial 6 months taught me enough to strum all the songs I ever wanted to play (I only play from 1 ukulele song book with 40 songs; but I sometimes go to my local uke meets and play other songs). Although I've not been actively learning since, I play almost everyday so I've got the strumming and chords basics down very, very well (ok, as long as I'm on the first 5 frets; yes, I think the 2223 (D) is the highest I venture).

Sometimes I have a desire to learn some finger picking on the uke, but it's never a strong-enough to motivate me to actually do something about it. So, I'm stuck in strum-land with the uke, and it looks like this is where I'll remain. This is not to say I can't finger pick; I can pick easy songs ok-ish, and I pick once in a while.

I think everybody has somewhere he/she wants to be with the uke. Once the skills needed to do what the uke is needed for have been acquired, then the impetus to learn and advance the skills kind of disappears.

Just curious. Did you stop atcively learning to play? What method(s) are you following? Progress? Future plans?

Maybe try live lessons with an instructor or something like the video exchanges on ArtistWorks? I find the feedback from Craig and Sarah has helped me improve immensely, as well as try things I might not normally try. Playing with a local group has also provided great motivation to improve.

 

[emba]

I think it sing and strum is where you want to be and it satisfies you, that’s fine. You play for you.

I’ve been playing about two years, and I’m kind of at the same place (easily strumming most of the songs I want to play with a group) but I’m not really satisfied with it. I’d like to be able to pick more, both melodies and accompaniment, and various other techniques too numerous to list, as well as learn more chords. So I do a little off this and a little of that and don’t focus long enough on any of it to get to where I want to be. And it’s easy to let a week go by and barely practice any because I’m busy with other life things.

what I’ve done the last few weeks that had really motivated its start doing the Seasons of the Ukulele here on these boards, submitting a video and trying to push myself a little with new songs or chords or whatever. It’s fun and gives me a chance to branch out from the music my group does.

 

[Oldscruggsfan]

I think it sing and strum is where you want to be and it satisfies you, that’s fine. You play for you.

I’ve been playing about two years, and I’m kind of at the same place (easily strumming most of the songs I want to play with a group) but I’m not really satisfied with it. I’d like to be able to pick more, both melodies and accompaniment, and various other techniques too numerous to list, as well as learn more chords. So I do a little off this and a little of that and don’t focus long enough on any of it to get to where I want to be. And it’s easy to let a week go by and barely practice any because I’m busy with other life things.

what I’ve done the last few weeks that had really motivated its start doing the Seasons of the Ukulele here on these boards, submitting a video and trying to push myself a little with new songs or chords or whatever. It’s fun and gives me a chance to branch out from the music my group does.

I agree. SOTU gives just the right nudge out of your comfort zone and it’s an unfailingly kind and encouraging audience.

 

[TimWilson]

Sometimes I have a desire to learn some finger picking on the uke, but it's never a strong-enough to motivate me to actually do something about it. So, I'm stuck in strum-land with the uke, and it looks like this is where I'll remain.

I think that this is the first step toward your next level, if that's where you'd like to go. That is, there are so many different ways to play (fingers, strumming, clawhammer, chord melody, etc etc), and so many different kinds of music (blues, gospel, rock, pop, Hawaiian, jazz, classical, etc etc) that honestly, I'm surprised more people don't give up sooner. Like guitar players. (Kidding, but maybe not?)

There's a lot to be said for realizing, "This is who I am." Taking stuff off the potential to-do list can be the most liberating thing of all!

That was my experience anyway. It wasn't that I learned all the songs I wanted to learn or whatever, it was that the number of things I wanted to learn was paralyzing me. I also currently lack the skill for some of what I want to accomplish eventually, and the in-between steps weren't fulfilling enough to keep me motivated. Combine that with my one hundred and nineteenth nervous breakdown taking me out for a few months, and I felt a need to reset.

For me, that revolves around a small handful of things. I can summarize the heart of it as, "Classic rock strumming plus chord melody riffs and solos." I play alone, so I don't want lead lines or improv solos that are just one plinky note after another. Not that good lead players sound plinky to me -- it's that plinky is all I'm really up to as a player right now. I don't enjoy improvising at all, in any area of my life (I suspect that most folks on the autism spectrum like myself would tell you something similar!), and one note at a time is the opposite of the sound I want. I'm the whole band, and I need more fullness. But there's only so big a hill I can climb right now.

Here's one example of what I'm talking about: Love Me Do from Vasko at Ukulele Cheats, with the harmonica solo turned into an easy chord melody riff. The heart of it is just G7 to G6 barring at the 7th, plus a Cadd9 which sounds fancy, but is just a finger on the 5th fret of the A string. It turns a pretty pedestrian campfire tune into something that pops, at least to my ears. Maybe not what you're looking for, but you'll see what I mean in just a few seconds.



Likewise, Aldrine's tutorial for Lucy In The Sky with Diamonds here at UU has a sweet little intro lick that you can carry as far as you'd like before turning the corner to strumming. I can barely keep my attention through the intro because finger picking is kind of alien to me, but I'm trying to bring it through at least the first verse, and transition to strumming for the chorus. Again, you'll see what I mean within the first few seconds.

[MEDIA]

That may not mean anything to you either, especially if you don't care about The Beatles but that's the gist: find the thing that you kinda like, and make it a little better.

So my second recent obsession has been on tone. I got kinda sloppy when I set myself the goal of a new song every week. That was fun for a while, but none of the songs sounded as good as I wanted them to. That was definitely de-motivating! Going back to square one and resetting my posture and hand positions has made my satisfaction go through the roof, even if my progress has slowed considerably. I'm not declaring songs finished and moving on nearly as quickly, but I'm digging it more.

Matt Stead has a terrific workshop on tone (ie, one long video at YT). The beginning is mostly about nails, so you may possibly want to click quickly through that part, but there's a bunch of great stuff there. Learning to better control my thumb has made a big difference all by itself. btw, Matt has by far the deepest set of free lessons for ukulele that I've yet encountered. Not so much the horizontal momentum of thousands of songs as much as vertical, going deeper into tone, style, and other elements that make for better playing, whatever style you're pursuing. Definitely poke around his channel!

I'm also finding that a lot of ukulele tutorials cut unnecessary corners. Yeah, there's a lot to be said for saying, "It only has four chords! Let's go!" But a couple of more chords, often just by moving a finger that I've already placed, sometimes just removing a finger, to create the extra bit of movement that really makes the songs come alive.

Somewhat related, @4stringboy is one of my favorite fellas to follow (I'm only doing YT and UU right now, but he's got a super-dynamic IG feed that I loved when I was still doing IG), and he's doing a series of "#chordvember" shorts that explore variations that are usually no more than a finger or two different than what you're used to, just in a different place. It's an approach to moveable chords that doesn't presuppose bar chords as the goal, but also this concept of slightly different getting you farther along.

For example, Bb is a drag no matter what, but Bb6 is just a G shape moved up to the 5th and 6th frets that subs nicely for Bb -- AND is easier to play, AND sounds gorgeous!



All four days of this series so far are gems, btw, and if you ever want to reconsider fingerstyle, Sammy's cheekily-named "Fingerstyle Fursdays" is a wall-to-wall delight of composition, performance, and pedagogy. I've realized that my finite mental resources and limited prowess preclude climbing up on top of playing this way (yet), but my goodness, this series is the definition of must-see TV. Gorgeous AND fun. Here's a link to the volume 1 playlist.

I'm going to end for now with my recent discovery that my uke's sweetest spots are in the 5th-8th frets. Maybe that's true for all of 'em. I have no idea. Your mileage may vary, but I do know about myself that I'm not going to be shredding at the 14th fret a la Jake and Aldrine, but man oh man, am I having BIG FUN going just the tiniest bit past what I used to think of as my outer limit. Sammy's variations are one place to begin exploring that. There are others, but the important thing to remember is that not all of them are ridiculously hard, not all of them demand bar chords, and some of them are actually easier than first-position chords while also breathing new life into old arrangements.

I suspect that there's a life lesson in there somewhere about going one step past your old limits, but you get the idea. I'm happier now that I'm trying less, and I'm hitting a higher percentage of my targets now that I have fewer of them. There's a life lesson there, too, I think!

Your mileage may vary, but the ukulele is the most important thing to come into my life for mental stability and the closest thing to joy that I'm likely to find since psychiatric meds. I hope you can find your way to someplace happier with it. Maybe "less is more" will work for you too?

 

[ploverwing]

@TimWilson dude you always have amazing stuff to add to the conversation. Thanks so much for taking the time, that's all really interesting. I agree with you about the "vertical" momentum of attempting to go deeper with better technique/skill building/posture etc. I am not learning more songs, but I'm trying to deepen my skill so that I'm better at the thing I'm doing. That's what I keep reminding myself

I like people's suggestion (not just here in this particular thread): find what you're interested in, and pick something from that which interests you enough to want to learn it more. Maybe, since you've indicated you don't go outside the first position, take one of your favourite songs, find different positions for those same chords, and relearn the song? Or transpose the song to a different key and relearn it? That's maybe not too big a stretch but enough of a challenge to interest you?

 

[Tin Ear]

Wow, lots of deep thought about learning, motivations etc.

Do what you want to do. What makes you happy and do it it when you want to do it. A little at a time if you want to expand - but be happy with where you are. Enjoy it. If you are happy where you are - go with it ! Keep it light and fun and advancement can sneak in rather than be a task or barrier.

 

[Joyful Uke]

I think it's easy to feel like you are learning mountains of new things when you first start, (especially if you didn't play another instrument first), because going from not even knowing how to hold and tune a ukulele to being able to play anything at all is a big leap. IMO, once you get further along in your learning, the learning may appear to have slowed down, but that's because you're already on your way.

Sometimes I think I'm not progressing much, but then realize that I'm finger picking something that I couldn't play a year ago. Or I'm playing something more smoothly, or with better tone, or it just sounds more musical than a year ago. Progress!

For me, I'm not attempting to learn certain techniques, or certain scales, or that type of thing. What motivates me is learning a particular piece of music. I find something that I'd really like to play, and then work on that. In the process, I may need to learn some techniques or whatever so I can play the piece. But I'm learning them with a purpose in mind - that particular piece - rather than just to check that skill off my list.

I personally have never made it through any of the online or book courses that I've tried. The problem for me is that they aren't necessarily playing the music I want to play. So, while they might be great for learning techniques, chords, and so on, I'm not motivated because it's not working towards MY goals.

So maybe it's a matter of deciding what your goals are?

There is no reason that you need to play up the neck if you don't want to, or that you need to finger pick if you don't want to. Most of us are just playing for our own enjoyment, and if we just want to spend the time strumming a single chord and that makes us happy, mission accomplished!

But maybe clarifying your goals, finding something that you want to learn, taking it one small step at a time to learn it would help you feel like you're progressing? And you can hopefully just enjoy where you currently are with your musical journey. That's what really matters.

 

[Joyful Uke]

TimWilson said: "That may not mean anything to you either, especially if you don't care about The Beatles but that's the gist: find the thing that you kinda like, and make it a little better."

What? There are people who don't care about The Beatles?? (Yes, yes, I know, plenty of people don't care, but I personally am a big fan. )
Your "make it a little better" comment made me think of "Getting better all the time. Can't get no worse."

I definitely agree Tim's suggestion to find the kind of thing that you like and focus on that, and not what someone else might think you should learn or play.

 

[clear]

Wow. Thank you! I'm amazed by the amount of support from all of you.

Although I stopped learning since the first 6 months that I picked up the uke, thanks to your replies, I think I'll dust off the old uke self-teach methods and at least finish them. I left off when the methods were moving into playing chord melodies.

I'm going to try to reply to all the questions in this thread. Please forgive me if I accidentally miss any.

 

[clear]

between them) and in at least two different keys. Have you tried single string harmonics?

I can play the string harmonics by themselves (I can also play beyond the frets, e.g. at 24th "fret"). However, since my uke music book doesn't call for them, I've yet to learned how to incorporated them into music.

 

[clear]

Maybe try live lessons with an instructor or something like the video exchanges on ArtistWorks? I find the feedback from Craig and Sarah has helped me improve immensely, as well as try things I might not normally try. Playing with a local group has also provided great motivation to improve.

I've not taken any in-person uke lessons (well, that's not totally correct; I have been to a few free uke tutorial/clinics run by the local uke meets. they are fun, but I don't think I learned anything).

I have taken many years of piano as a kid and some guitar lessons. For the past 2 years, I've been taking in-person (acoustic/electric/classical) and online (classical) guitar lessons; both gives me feedback (live and via video).

I do agree that getting feedback is critical to improvement. So, perhaps I should look into some uke lessons with feedback. However, 2 guitar lessons is sucking a lot of my "music" time ATM. I'll have to think about it more.

 

[clear]

I think that this is the first step toward your next level, if that's where you'd like to go. That is, there are so many different ways to play (fingers, strumming, clawhammer, chord melody, etc etc), and so many different kinds of music (blues, gospel, rock, pop, Hawaiian, jazz, classical, etc etc) that honestly, I'm surprised more people don't give up sooner. Like guitar players. (Kidding, but maybe not?)

What? Give up the uke? Hahaha. You must be joking. Who'd want to give up such a fun, cute, and one-of-the-easiest-to-play instruments? Definitely not!

But, I woldn't be surprised to find many others like me who stop learning after a few months and just continue playing at that level for the rest of their lives.

Your mileage may vary, but the ukulele is the most important thing to come into my life for mental stability and the closest thing to joy that I'm likely to find since psychiatric meds. I hope you can find your way to someplace happier with it. Maybe "less is more" will work for you too?

The ukulele is really important to me too; so, after reading the support in this thread, I want to put in a few more months and finish the self-teach methods I started years ago. I guess I probably wasn't all that happy at being stuck at a 6-month-beginner level (hence this thread). Tim, thanks for detailed reply and encouragement to move forward.

 

[clear]

learn it more. Maybe, since you've indicated you don't go outside the first position, take one of your favourite songs, find different positions for those same chords, and relearn the song? Or transpose the song to a different key and relearn it?

For the uke, I only play from 1 music book that stays in the 1st position (actually, it was my first and only book) and the local uke jams also stays there. It's not that I only want to play in 1st position (although technically 2225 is second position , I'm there because of the music I play.

That's maybe not too big a stretch but enough of a challenge to interest you?

Hahaha. You don't know how easy it is to overestimate my musical abilities.

 

[clear]

So maybe it's a matter of deciding what your goals are?

I think this is key. After 6 months, I've pretty much learned everything I need the uke to do for me.

I don't really play the uke for myself; instead, I play it for my son because , the truth is, If one day he decides not to like the uke, I think I'll probably quit. I like it, but (being old enough) I also know how high its priority is in my life.

But maybe clarifying your goals, finding something that you want to learn, taking it one small step at a time to learn it would help you feel like you're progressing? And you can hopefully just enjoy where you currently are with your musical journey. That's what really matters.

Definitely, it isn't a bad thing to exapnd my skills on the uke. If I never try it, then I'll never know. I think I'll learn a few new things on the uke and see how it goes. Thanks.

 

[Joyful Uke]

I don't really play the uke for myself; instead, I play it for my son because , the truth is, If one day he decides not to like the uke, I think I'll probably quit. I like it, but (being old enough) I also know how high its priority is in my life.

Ah ha! Your goal is less about playing ukulele than it is about spending time with your son and giving him enjoyment. Now that's a very worthy goal, for sure.

It also sounds like your musical interests might be more with guitar than ukulele?

I don't know how old your son is, but maybe he'll be able to join you in playing some day, and that will bring you to a whole different level with this experience. However it all goes, enjoy the special time with your son.

 

[clear]

What? There are people who don't care about The Beatles?? (Yes, yes, I know, plenty of people don't care, but I personally am a big fan. )

You know, I actually can't remember ever hearing any of their songs. I grew up on western classical, Elvis, and Chinese pop (which is based on western pop). I remember there was a radio contest where they played Mozart and asked the listeners to name all the pieces as a contest, I was totally at home with the contest. Later, I stopped listening to music (figured it a waste of time); I don't even turn on my car's radio (I still don't like driving with the radio on).

Music was out of my life for many years. I was too busy with other things. The only time I get a dose of music is when it was part of something else. Recently, I got back into music. In many ways, I'm at a great disadvantage because I don't have the years of music basis. For example, my guitar teacher taught me Beatles Let It Be. I had no idea what song that is

 

[clear]

It also sounds like your musical interests might be more with guitar than ukulele?

I play whatever instrument my son requests. He's been requesting guitar for more than the uke lately.

I miss the times he requested piano because, thanks to him, I've gotten pretty good at it. One day, I heard a song playing on the piano (Mozart Turkish march, one the songs he requests often) and thought, "hey, the piano already have this song, why am I keep playing it"; then I go and see that it was one of my own recordinging. I was very proud at that moment with myself